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9:23 pm
March 8, 2009
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Our current insurance company says no problem having a security team as long as they are not armed. Does anyone know anything about where to get or how to obtain insurance for the church that would cover an armed team. our team is trained and all have CCW permits, so that is no issue. thanks!
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10:24 am
March 13, 2009
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Glen
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Hey Man,
Were you able to get an answer on the church insurance issue?
G
mfuhr64@hotmail.com said:
Our current insurance company says no problem having a security team as long as they are not armed. Does anyone know anything about where to get or how to obtain insurance for the church that would cover an armed team. our team is trained and all have CCW permits, so that is no issue. thanks!
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6:58 am
March 15, 2009
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Jack Justice
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Mfuhr64
Here is what our agent explained to us. Read your policy carefully and if possible have your church lawyer read it too. Anything that is not specifically eliminated is covered. However, I think you should make sure that the carrier agrees. One company that will cover an armed security team is GuideOne. They specialize in Churches and have had to deal with that situation.
One item we were told was that the armed members needed to be properly trained. We are fortunate that Glen is a state approved law enforcement handgun certified trainer. I believe that if you have members of the team armed, you must have a level of firearms training similar to your states required training for a police officer. In reality, the level of training should be to that of a first responder trained to deal with an active shooter.
Additionally, you must make sure that the mental attitude is correct. Not everyone is suited to engaging a shooter. Remember the CCW carrier in the mall in Washington a few years back, he could not bring himself to fire at an active shooter because he was a "kid".
As it has been said, being armed does not make me a warrior any more that owning a piano makes me a concert pianist.
Let us know what you do. Jack
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8:51 pm
March 16, 2009
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| | Port Saint Lucie, Florida | |
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Some insurance carriers require your people get an armed security guard license. Those that do, make the distinction that since they are organized for the purpose of security it is different than just a “good Samaritan” in the congregation.
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5:27 am
March 17, 2009
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| | Definace, Ohio | |
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To the original poster,
Why not look into non-lethal weapons for starters? This should get you past the insurance "snag". I liked the idea of pepper spray pens, batons, and stun guns? If you look back at most of the church shootings going on this last couple of years, most could of been dealt with, with just these "no-lethal" weapons. Just my .02! I know after much praying and discussing, guns where not the solutions at our church! Thanks.
Head_deacon
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5:57 am
March 17, 2009
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SMince2
| | Northeast Alabama | |
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FYI, all the 'non-lethal' weapons mentioned, plus TASERS, can be lethal under the correct set of variables.
Don't lull yourselves into a false sense of security by thinking you are safe from any liability.
IMO, there needs to be a force continuum that begins with non-physical/verbal and progresses up to and including use of lethal force. Training is where you learn the level of force required.
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4:04 pm
March 17, 2009
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mfuhr64@hotmail.com said:
Our current insurance company says no problem having a security team as long as they are not armed. Does anyone know anything about where to get or how to obtain insurance for the church that would cover an armed team. our team is trained and all have CCW permits, so that is no issue. thanks!
thanks everybody for your input. I had a long talk with our insurance agent and read the policy front to back. I used to be an adjuster years ago, so I have some experience reading policies. Our company, Guideone, does 'allow' armed volunteers, but the cost is restrictive. There are the expected requirements, certified training, annual re-training, known volunteer recruiting policy, background checks etc. – we've done all of this and are in process of documenting it for Guideone. Now the underwriter is telling me they will most likely charge $400 to $500 per year PER volunteer if we go through with this. How can there exposure be increased by 10% of the total cost of our policy per volunteer? #1 the odds of anything happening are slim and #2 is it better to let your unarmed people get killed and innocent churchgoers get killed or hurt by a gunman than to take the risk of collateral damage done by a trained security volunteer? I'm very disappointed with the answers I'm getting from Guideone. Any suggestions from anyone would be appreciated :)
thanks! Mark (sr. pastor)
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10:49 pm
May 8, 2009
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| | Independence, Missouri | |
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I just joined the group and perhaps you have found a solution already. Just thinking "out of the box" and, this is something you would want to obviously discuss with your church attorney; would it be possible to set up a self insurance fund to specifically cover the armed security team members and still keep the GuideOne policy in place for other issues?
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